Minha distro SYS e pacotes compativeis com Slackware

[werner]

About the SYS repository: In / are only the newest packages, in /old all, new and older versions and some packages which people normally not need (such as SYS*.tgz which are the maintaining packages i.e. corrections between minor versions, or the backup-install system). Before, I had put in / only the new and in /old only the meanwhile obsolete packages, however it was many work and gave at the end a total chaos to shift something from/ to /old on the mirrors (it neede 3 steps and 3 rsync cycles: first to make a hardlink, than waiting syncing, then delete it in /). Now everything what I put into / gets imediately a hardlink to /old, and after some time when it becomes obsolete I delete it just in /.

You need only things from / , not from /old, and even in / are meanwhile too much old things so that I need to clean it off.

The mirrors above are fast. If too fast for your connection, I have also slow mirrors in Africa, Russia and Brazil:
ftp://ftp.polytechnic.edu.na/pub/SYS
ftp://ftp.chg.ru/pub/Linux/sys/
http://sys.c3sl.ufpr.br/

The best install DVD, normally, is the 'current' DVD, SYS_Linux.iso . Since 2.6.27 the drivers were rewroten and there had many regressions so that I didnt updated the kernel on the install DVD, see the note to the 2.6.27-28 packages, but since 2.6.29-rc8 things became stable, so that perhaps in 1 month or so I could make even a new version.

The installation needs, depending on the version, 17-19 GB. The installer resizes half-full partitions, but this takes time, and is principally for Linux beginners to warrant that a transformation from Windows to Linux suceeds anyway. Users which are familiar with Linux, can make before 20 GB NOT-PARTITIONED space. For this one can use the rescue system (1st option window). This also have nice recovery tools, premounts harddisk and usb-key partitions, and have the mc etc. Normally the installation runs full-automatical (put the CD in and let it boot and wait until the DVD comes out), and on a modern computer after 15-20 min. beginner and specialists get most easy and most fast possible a simple usable but huge and almost complete professional system. Only exceptionally one have to intervent (f.ex. on laptops with a buggy BIOS (nothing happening) one have to boot with the r option, or which dont deal correctly the screensaver andthe screen goes off during the installation, press the CTRL button) Many neighbours, friends etc whhic I givee the DVD are satisfied with SYS and go even to their friends and install it there too because the installation is very easy

SYS used KDE as default, but going with the mouse in the upper left corner opens the GNOME menu. This however is good to switch off on slow computers, like tripwire, fc-cache etc too. The desktop one can administrate with the KDE control center, the system with linuxconf (as program or server) or webmin

[zoros]

ok werner,
I understood your technical considerations ... there are still some doubts about method to force install without asking questions (as mentioned in some articles I read in Internet) ...

however I will try your SYS-distro since may be a fast way to get and replicate installations ...

Regards
Fabio

[zoros]

I've successfully installed SYS in a Athlon-xp 2100+, 768MB RAM, HD 160GB ... disk already partitioned with 4 primary partitions:

Codice: Seleziona tutto

Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x063ca25b

   Device    Boot  Start      End      Blocks        Id  System
/dev/hda1     *       1     2359     18948539     83  Linux
/dev/hda2          5420      5547     1028160     82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3          8353      19929   92992252+    83  Linux
/dev/hda4          5548      6822     10241437+   83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

SYS-installer has choose hda1 (with an old Fedora installed) as "/", other partitions (and data inside) are unchanged ...
installer messages are in German and Portuguese (both languages are not easy for Italians, I think) ...

SYS-distro is a true huge, very rich of programs ... I don't try 3D effects now, because this PC has a poor graphic card ... later I will try installation in a new PC with higher performance

Only a problem, now:
in KDE "Control Center" I cannot choose Italian language ... i18n-kde-it is not included in this distro ?

[werner]

I repeat here very briefly the history/beginning of the distro, in order to understand better its principal intention and principles:
1) For maintaining my own server, and avoid the chaos of parallel installation of packages and source-compilations, in mid-2007 i begun to package all progs what I compiled. There the next step, to make also an install DVD, was near
2) I often copied my hard disk to friends, neighbours etc. I thought to make a backup-reinstall system to dump my installation to an reinstallable DVD, also for my own backups
3) End 2007 came up again the discusion about the children-grandmother-mongoloid-dog desktop usibility of Linux. I see from my neighbours what problems have simple persons with Linux. Suggestions to the maintainers of existing distros weer not heared. Thus I decided to make finally an own distro, putting in this ideas.

This resulted in the following principles for SYS:

/ Instalation have to be maximally easy. Full-Automatically. If there is something to configurate manually, then one do this in the final system who has available all professional, ready tools like KDE Control Center or Linuxconf. No manual partitioning. If there is still the amount X on the hard-disk necessary for the installation, then the installer have alone to resize/move existing partitions to get X no-partitioned space, when not but when there is a Windows partition then the installer have to delete it, or at least cut X at its end. Only when there is already any Linux partition, it stops if there isnt enough space.
/ Thus, it have to be assegured that any not-yet-Linux-computer/owner is transformed anyway successful to Linux. CONSEQUENTLY, DEFINITIVELY, FINALLY, and MOST FAST/MOST EASY - not like a gazelle but more like an elefant, incl. passing over Windows. No live-CD where people 1000x try but let Windows installed - in the same time you start a live-CD of 2x the size like Sabayon, you install it !! SYS nor ask the user, the most beginnersnor know whats Linux, and when necessary Windows will be deelted. But its important that the person is satisfied, to stay with the installation, and dont miss something what he used daily.
/ Not a poor-man distro like SLAX or Ubuntu where since the beginning people need to download more progs. In my area, many people havnt internet, the most install DVDs circulated manually. Many people return to Windows because on Linux something is missing what they knowed and like to use. Thus, no theoretical or puristic considerations, but a huge system with plenty progs and drivers for anything whats possible in Linux. Also, wine with some Windows progs wheer Linux have no corresponding ones.
/ Although principally for beginners, the distro should also be complete for specialists on many areas. For my own needs, server things and development / packaging, for some friends office and financial progs, for simple people everything of multimedia. One see that SYS is intended a) for the beginners and b) for the specialists, which want a robust, good working system with plenty tools, but dont take care of c) the middle-class, people with half knowledge and searching fru-fru.

The first working SYS DVDs, version 0.16ss , I gave to friends, neighbours, children etc, told them that it have many video applications and games, only put it in, reboot, and wait until it come out. In short time, my neighbourhood was cured from Windows, everybody was satisfied and use SSY until today. People gone to their friends / neighbours in turn and put in the DVD on their computers too. This is, because the installation have to be most easy.


I want include in the installer, that it reads language, keyboard-language, name, internet-passwords etc from any pre-existing Windows instalation. Perhaps someone could tell me, in which files of Windows such informations are stocked ???



Now to respond the questions of the previous post:

/ Italian Language package isnt installed, sorry, you can installed this from Slackware. The first DVDs were only in portuguese because circulated manually here, later I put also german and english, the most mirrors and users in Europa are in Germany. When I dont forget it, on the next version I could put in the italian language package too

/ 3d starts by typing in "compiz-manager", or (what often needs more time) search the compiz icon in the menus. I didnt put it on the desktop because 3d dont work on all computers and is fru-fru for the middle-class. With intel grafic chip computers, it should work directly -- it works on my Asus EEEPC andon my MS wind -- , with other 3d-able chips (the most, except NVIDIA which has no open mesa drivers) one can substitute their name into /etc/X11/xorg.conf-laptop and copy this over /etc/X11/xorg.conf then 3d should work

/ The installer makes always a primary, never an extended partition. When there are already 4 primary partitions, then one need to be deleted -- or at least disabled. I suppose your old partition exists still on the "free" space, go in fdisk, write the partition limits on a paper -- using sector not track as unit !! -- then delete one partition, then make a new one at the previously "free" space, don't format, then after reboot there you should re-discover your previous data.
Saying you have a hard-disk of 100 GB: Part. 1 occupies position 1-20, part. 2 occupies 21-40 , 3: 41-60; 4: 61-80. Now you want to make a primary partition at position 81-100, for this you have to delete any of the other partitions with fdisk. You will not loose the files there -- so long you dont overwrite that space -- and can 'recover' the old partitions with fdisk, by 'deleting' another partiiton for giving its number to the space to recover. You dont have a lack of space, but a lack of numbers 1-4.
Now whats important -- but also obvious. After this, you HAVE to decide which 4 partitions you want to keep, and enable them with fdisk -- principally you have to save any data on the disabled/'deleted' partition. Because that space is now considered as empty/not-partitioned, and any next partition operation can destroy the data too.

Yes, there seems to have gone something wrong on your instalation.
I suppose the old Fedora installation, Part. 1, was at tracks 1-5419 , after this comes the swap partition, after 2 other Linux systems.
The automatical installer would now resize Partition 1, corresponding how full it is, saying to 1-2359, and then 'delete' / disable it by fdisk, in order to can give the partition-number 1 to the space 2360-5419 where it installs SYS. After this, the user has to save the files on tracks 1-2359 if he need them still.
Otherwhise, when you make a 2nd SYS installation (f.ex. after interrupting the 1st one), happens the same again: the installer will 'delete'/desable partition 1 at 2360-5419, where is the half-suceeded 1st SYS installation, and will give the number 1 to the space 1-2359, CONSIDERED AS NOT-PARTITIONED, and will do the 2nd installation there, now really overwriting the Fedora files.
That's this what happened, I see also from the fact, that normally the installer would have increased the size to 1-5419, but it dont do this when there is such an disabled/'deleted' partition for give the user the chance to save the files there.
So you see the installer do always the best to find empty space, or free partition numbers. However, in exceptional cases -- like, to do the installation 2 times -- can go something wrong. I'll think to put an advice in the installer, when have already 4 partitions and one is disabled to get a free number, the person after should save the files theer before do anything else.

/ Generally, the installer works different if there existed already a Linux partition or not. Because people which know already Linux, dont need so urgently be reformed to Linux like the MS-brainwashed only-Windows users, and also the Linux users normally know to help themselve. Thus, normally the installer dont delete LINUX data/partitions -- in the worsest case of 4 partitions (but enough empty space) it hide one partiiton which after can be recovered as explained. When there is not enough space but a Linux partition, then the installer stops -- the user can use the rescue system to make manually space. When there isnt enough free space but only Windows partiitons, then the installer deleate one, or cut 20GB at its end, to assegurate that the computer after anyway runns under Linux
The installer is not treating / redimensioning correcly extended partitions which are not at the beginning or end but in the middle so that for install SYS one would need to be redimensioned. However, that situation is so seldom that until now i didnt care to search and correct that problem.
The automatical space-finding is for beginners -- which normally havent a complicated partitioning. Specialists can use the rescue system to make free space exactly where they want it.
Please observe that it have be 18-20GB NOT-PARTITIONED SPACE. It should NOT be an empty partition.

[slucky]

Then I experienced your distro, but there are varied things to improve and to change:

1) the Italian have to be us also to facilitate the installation;
2) l' completely automatic installation does not go well, is necessary to leave the possibility to the user to decide on what division to install sys
and also for the bootloader goes left the choice to the user;
3)18 gb of software are too, the system so becomes already weighing and slow at booting..best choice is "to leave" freedom to the user of to choose does to install itself and Detail installing sys. ..so now, according to me, in this moment, the better choice remains always to install
and to personalize by itself the Slackware. ..the mother of every distro!!!

Without offense...

[werner]

Iself used Slackware practically since the beginning, and it is without doubts an excellent distro for persons which have knowledge about Linux.

However, the motivation, priorities and the persons versed by SYS were another -- see my previous post. Slackware isn't good for adapt Window-users to Linux (this begins already that after the installation it opens in text-mode); Slackware didnt bring forwards the Linux desktop usability, and for dump an existing system to a DVD and/or get installed most fast and simple possible a huge system with all normal tools, this can noy be package-oriented like Slackware, but using a ready system in a big bz2 or lzma -file like in live CDs. Most people and ALL beginners coming from Windows want kmplayer, amsn, etc etc and this Slackware simply dont have. Distros like Slackware for one kind of users, distros like SYS for another kind !! Although I give great value to Slackware, I dont make the mistake to make a religion from my prefered distro, but I see what needs to be corrected to bring Linux forwards and to make it util for simple persons, and try to do this with my SYS. At least however I take care that my packages are compatible (other than these by Vector or Zenwalk) so that they can be used by other distros.


Correct is also my opinion, that the partitioning have to be automatical, if there is still enough free space X=18 GB on the hard-disk, then the computer has to reorganize alone files and partitions to get empty space togehter for make a partition for the instalation. Many simple persons dont know whats a hard-disk, much less what are partitions. And a normal person what get a computer/laptop working from the shop, for watch video or use internet, really dont need to know this. Do you know all peaces inside your mobil phone or wash-machine ??? When I was a little boy, I knowed each screw inside my motor bike, because I desmounted everything almost every day. Later however I didnt want to know longer these details -- I just want that it works. And in a few years, I also dont want to know longer details like hard-disk or partitions in my computer, but I just want that it works and I can use internet, all periphericals, listen/watch musics/video, and write letters etc. When until then Linux dont become better for this, then I'm tired to hear the religious or puristic exculpations orexplanations, but just throw it out and use Windows. And just this is the mind of 99,9% of the persons. Its sufficient that people get a webcam what dont work for they throw out Linux and install Windows. Before, I kept for wrong this opinion -- meanwhile however I agree. Linux became a playground for individualists and specialists which want to show others how complicated they can do everything and which dont take care of the simple people's need, which correctly in turn don't take care of them and use Windows.

Thus, the auto-partitioning is not a principal question to discuss, but only question of its good tecnical realization. In almost all cases the SYS installer works correctly, problems what I know about involves only extended partitions which are neither at the beginning nor at the end but in the middle, but this is so seldom and never happens with beginner's computers, so that I ignored this until now.

And specialists HAVE the possibility to make empty space where they want - f.ex. with the rescue system. F.ex. with parted you can resize and move partitions.


On the other side, WITHIN THE PRINCIPLES OF SYS, what really should be improved or better explained/advised, I change imediately. After the previous post, in the case of 4 pre-existing partitions so that 1 of them will be desabled, I thinked its good to put in a alert window to save relevant files of that partition after the instalation, before doing a next instalation or resizing partitions, and I put this in the installer already.



What has the size of the distro to do with the booting or running speed ??????????? Nothing !! SYS boots so fast or slow like Slackware, because it are essentially the same scripts in /etc/rc.d which it passes. Whom want it faster should buy more memory. What really is a problem, are such inventary programs like fam, tripwire, google-deskop, fc-cache, etc, and on small computers one should disable them.

According to my opinion, slacky should make an own distro. And with this alsomake it most easy for simple people to install Linux. I suggested this already to the packagers long time ago, before I started my distro. However, they want to continue with their religion to the Slackware man .

[zoros]

Excuse me Werner,
there are some miss-understand, your installer has worked properly and has reached your target: "install SYS" ... I've tested your system (for you, to put a feedback) in a particular situation, with 4 primary partitions, and blank space before first partition ... so your installer has deleted first partition and then create new one, but at begin of disk ...

beyond this problem, installation was processed sucessfully, but consider this situation in next releases ...
this part of SYS_Linux.install.nnn.log will explain to you what happened:

Codice: Seleziona tutto

....
umount: /dev/hda7: not mounted
umount: /dev/hda8: not mounted
umount: /dev/hda9: not mounted

The number of cylinders for this disk is set to 19929.
There is nothing wrong with that, but this is larger than 1024,
and could in certain setups cause problems with:
1) software that runs at boot time (e.g., old versions of LILO)
2) booting and partitioning software from other OSs
   (e.g., DOS FDISK, OS/2 FDISK)

Command (m for help): Changing display/entry units to sectors

Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1        37897335    87056234    24579450   83  Linux
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1        37897335    87056234    24579450   83  Linux
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): Partition number (1-4): 
Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): Partition number (1-4): Warning: partition 1 has empty type

Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): Command action
   e   extended
   p   primary partition (1-4)
Selected partition 1
First sector (63-320173055, default 63): Last sector or +size or +sizeM or +sizeK (129-87056234, default 87056234): 
Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1             129    37897206    18948539   83  Linux
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): Partition number (1-4): 
Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1   *         129    37897206    18948539   83  Linux
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): 
Disk /dev/hda: 163.9 GB, 163928604672 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19929 cylinders, total 320173056 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/hda1   *         129    37897206    18948539   83  Linux
/dev/hda2        87056235    89112554     1028160   82  Linux swap
/dev/hda3       134174880   320159384    92992252+  83  Linux
/dev/hda4        89112555   109595429    10241437+  83  Linux

Partition table entries are not in disk order

Command (m for help): The partition table has been altered!

Calling ioctl() to re-read partition table.
Syncing disks.
 

*** neue  Partitionen : 

....

At this point another question: do you have a SYS support forum ?

I think that the use of Slacky.eu for any questions about SYS problems is not right way ...

[werner]

Ah, OK when there was free space before the 1st partition, then everything gone correct. Inclusive that the installer disabled/'deleted' in fdisk the partition 2360-5419 for get a free partition number 1-4. But anyway its correct that I should include an advice that the person, after the installation, save its files from that disabled partition -- and this advice dialog, I inserted in the afternoon in the installer. for save these files, go in fdisk, write the geometry on a paper, 'delete' any other partition and open the old partition temporarily, then reboot, mount the partition, copy all files somewhere else, and then disable the partition in fdisk definitively reestablishing the other. Important is NOT to format any partition after re-establishing it by fdisk.

I also watch at the log file for see if something gone wrong. PS: in the logfile is everything OK


I hope you like SYS. Still a few infos for the use:

Recently in the kernel were included / rewroten many drivers. You could additionally use kernel 2.6.29. Normally its just to download it, and then execute installpkg linux*.tgz .

The new kernels however for some machines call sda what before was hda. Then the auto-installation of lilo fails. To resolve that, one have to edit /etc/lilo.conf, and after execute lilo.

In lilo.conf, then one have to write for each kernel the root-partition so as that kernel see it -- f.ex. in the section for 2.6.26.2 root=/dev/hda1 and in the section for 2.6.29 root=/dev/sda1

Also, one have to put inside /dev the device files /dev/hda, hda1, sda, sda1 -- otherwhise lilo stops reclaiming that the device is wrong. One can make these device files with mknode, or copy them from the initrd (in /boot) or install DVD. In SYS, I call the initrd as initrd.cpio.gz , so that its opening when you go with mc there and press <return>



I had a SYS forum, however rcently I reorganized my server and didnt renew the forum, but I"ll think to do this.
PS: I found a copy of that forum, updated it slightly and let it run here: http://sys-linux.yi.org/forum/ However im not sure if its accessible from outside my lan, also, my computer dont run always but often I switch it off. And the forum program has a bug, often one have to add /index.php and/or demand it 2-3 times until it opens. Try it.